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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 10-29-2011, 07:47 AM
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Oh...it is about the leak!

If the leak is behind the fuel source (carburetor)...then the air/fuel ratio is thinned (with more air from the leak) causing a lean condition. If the leak is at one of the heads...that would be the lean cylinder. An engine will run with a leak. So...a leak in the manifold is a valid reason for a lean condition in one cylinder.

A multi-cylinder engine pulling from the same intake will often have one cylinder stealing from the other for a number of reasons. Also, mechanical timing in that engine can be different from one cylinder to the other (different rod length, different deck height, etc.). One reason I mention the ability of some ignition modules to alter timing to the rear cylinder in a single fire setup. The change in time can make more power in the engine by compensating for different cylinder temperatures and mechanical variance. It is not a prefect world.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 10-29-2011, 08:23 AM
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thank you.....my point exactly.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 10-29-2011, 08:42 AM
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And talk about chasing your tail, I was always taught to make sure the engine mechanically sound before moving onto troubleshooting timing, carb, valve adjustment or whatever.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2011, 08:50 AM
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Who builds a motor with different staggers? Anyone stagger a V-8's cylinder bank for stagger? No. Slant-6 ever have 3 staggered cylinders? Mopar's V-10 have 5 pistons with different deck heights, rods shorter? Who makes this kind engine with different sides to alter as if there are two different pistons for the rear and front?

To this day, I have yet to see an engine half stagger the one bank. Chase my tail again. You brought up a straw and a suck out of that. If there was a tiny hole in the straw, would both cylinders receive the same tiny hole or just one lung being the dominate sucker, the other is not affected is what you are saying. Do we have a valve lash operating in a lag lift? Are we having a compression problem with one cylinder throwing off the plug read?

I see you are still chasing a lean leak and the OP has said nothing about poor driveability, bad idle, runs poor at some point, but no. All that is being said is that one plug looks odd on the surface, but has yet to be read properly deep down to know for sure.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2011, 09:04 AM
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Now, I'll admit there is a stagger idle lean drop kind of (+/-) to run a throttle sync on the bike I bought for testing closed loop. It says to run the rear cylinder with a C0% of .50 difference than the other. Sound like an emissions loophole? Would syncing the .50 out of that compliance being all legal speak mean anything? I found the rods and pistons are the same part number. What does that tell you? Would no the one cylinder be all even with the other cylinder be the more balanced sync? I'm going to know in a few days.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 10-30-2011, 03:53 PM
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A V-Twin is TWO straws sucking. If one straw (head intake seal) has a hole in it...which cylinder gets more outside air (not pulling A/F from the carb)? Yes, the one with the hole in it!

And nobody is necessarily chasing a lean condition...just setting the record straight that a leak that occurs behind the A/F (carb) intake adds air that will lean a cylinder from another that does not leak. The concept that all engine air comes in only through the intake is inaccurate and excludes complete troubleshooting. What would a torn intake valve seal do to a cylinder with worn guides? A crack? A bad intake manifold seal? Yeah, more air in that cylinder.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 10-31-2011, 08:26 AM
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 10-31-2011, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MechWerks View Post
A V-Twin is TWO straws sucking.
Are you now going to tell me there are 8 straws [V-8] sucks, one carb, you say only one straw is going to suck lean out of one carb manifold. I welded up the plenum runners to the heads. Only leak is out of that carb gasket.

Tell me, are we on the same page now, lean is one cylinder or all? I want to get the record all woundownow up is up to you to figure it out. I am not a 'more air' think kind of guy.

I would think the first kick on the leaking manifold, [on the head side], not the carb gasket side = Would be a hard starting bike; leaned out that close to the valve; note: that far away from the carb. I would not guess. I would flat out say, that is a leak on the intake, hard start, lean on the other carb, is straw #2 too... Just for the record.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 10-31-2011, 04:25 PM
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Yes, V-8 is eight straws. As each drops in their bore, a volume of air is displaced and will be replaced by ambient air via the engine intake. The essence of a "naturally aspirated" engine. It is the natural outside air pressure that forces air through the cab, intake, valve and fills the cylinder. An air leak, like a bad gasket between the head and intake manifold will allow outside air pressure in without first going through the carb and mixing with fuel. That simple leak will cause a lean condition in one cylinder.

The other cylinders may start very easily and run normally, but the cylinder with an air leak will run lean.

Simple engine 101.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 11-01-2011, 06:00 AM
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only one intake valve is open at a time

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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 11-04-2011, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MechWerks View Post
Yes, V-8 is eight straws.

The other cylinders may start very easily and run normally, but the cylinder with an air leak will run lean.

Simple engine 101.
That is what I am saying. Engine suck 101. I said I welded up the plenums to the heads. Again, Show me the lean cylinder.

Engine suck 101 says I am going to enter 2 variables:

Cold: I am condensed air. I am a lot more molecules than say we cube a square of cold air. Would you agree this is more dense than a cube of hot air? I'm going with yes. That is one dense air is the variable going in.
Close of the valve, the suck has ended. Here comes variable 2.

Engine suck 101 says I am 14.7 psi in the constant is the 2nd variable. I am going to stick with that. I'm going to suck it up if you think it is wrong. I want to see you bring in some hot air now. I want to see that other number you think you have.

Give me that valve job! I think use is getting the job of the valve is IS. I welded my plenums. I welded my plenums asnowon listens to turtle. Now, again, the penultimate question IS?
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 11-04-2011, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HogFixer View Post
only one intake valve is open at a time
Thank you!

And now, with my plenums all welded up, no leaks, I have a throttle body gasket leak. Will only one cylinder get that leak or 8 straws sucking on that one leak, yes or no?

Did you see my video and how short that air leak is from one cylinder to the other? That intake manifold is going to feed both cylinders the same? Was that leak being the closest to the other head, easier to pull than say, move all the way up the air cleaner opening? Think distance. Who is shorter with a closed throttle plate? The leak at one intake gasket or the air under the closed plate 101?
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