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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2012, 09:48 AM
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45 degree rake - Help! Vstar wheel flop.

New member, sorry if I'm stepping on any toes - and especially if this is a double post. Here's the bike. I love the look. It has 45 degrees of head rake, and probably 10" of trail. Rides great and true at any speed above 25 mph.

But below 20 mph it has scary wheel flop. I'm a lifelong biker, but I don't want any first crashes at age 72. So ... do I have any options to:
  1. Save both the rake and the tubes but reduce wheel flop?
  2. Save the rake and change the fork?
  3. Change the trees (negative rake?)


Thanks for your help.

Dooce
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2012, 02:24 PM
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first of all welcome to the site.....secondly that a very nice bike... nice lines..
if it was me i would get springer front end.. you would be able to dial in the trail with the rockers and i think it would accent the bike well.... . please be safe on that bike old timer
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Old 10-13-2012, 03:08 PM
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Dumb question but have you checked the neck bolt?
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Old 10-13-2012, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rastoy View Post
Dumb question but have you checked the neck bolt?
No I haven't. I know a bit about reducing fall away by tightening the neck bolt, but will it help relieve serious wheel flop?
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 10-16-2012, 07:23 AM
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It looks like those are zero rake trees...you could try raked trees, or I do believe there are raked cups, but my understanding of their effectiveness is somewhat limited...tightening the bolt will not solve the issue properly. I second the Springer idea...raked trees will fix the flop, but may lower the front end slightly, where as longer rockers on a springer accomplishes the same decrease in trail without changing the level of the bike.

That is THE best looking vstar chop I've seen though! Can you post a pic of the shaft side? would like to see how you handled the drive and any additional details of the build would be awesome!
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Old 10-16-2012, 06:05 PM
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love your vstar!
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Old 10-17-2012, 08:44 AM
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Great looking chop!

Forks are too short (period). Your lower frame rails should be level or a little taller in the front, your bike looks nosed down to me. Also, jack it up and spin the wheel and look for tire flop, check the bead and make sure it is seated straight.
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Old 10-17-2012, 02:36 PM
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if it were me..

5 - 6 degree trees and longer fork tubes. Agree with frame rails statement - tubes are on the short side already. Better to fix problem correctly and safely. Just my opinion. Tubes aren't that much - need custom size, go to Forks by Frank / Franks Engineering in Evanston, IL - will not find better, or higher quality, anywhere. (P.S. - don't ask for Frank - he died many years ago. But still family run.)
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Old 10-23-2012, 05:21 PM
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Longer forks, and wider bars. Narrow bars make your arms work more... I'd stay away from raked trees... my 2 cents... Maybe add a steering damper too...
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Old 10-23-2012, 05:43 PM
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do your research...

do a little bit of research - you'll find plenty of very good knowledgable sources for info about raked trees, and how to CORRECTLY use them. There is a good reason why you have wheel flop now.... just be glad its not a high speed wobble.
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:07 AM
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Yea, good solution would be longer tubes and "raked" trees/yokes - they don't actually add rake, they add offset, which is the distance between your steering axis and the centre of your wheel ("deeper" trees/yokes, with holes still parallel but further between stem ctr and tubes, would do the same thing). This then reduces your trail which is what you need right now: 10" is way too much. Not sure you'd need as much as 6 deg., but it's basic trig, so you can work it out yourself easy enough (see attached diag.), my guess would be to look for about 6" trail. Also, "raked" trees alone will drop your front end even further, when in fact it's already a bit low, so you do need longer fork tubes too.

The alternative of a springer is valid, as it can be used to acheive the same objective, but obviously may cost more; normally springers are less effective as actual suspension than tele's, but at more extreme rakes tele's start to function less well, and springers (provided you've got the rocker axes approximately horizontal) carry on working just the same. You could also look at a girder fork, but not sure who there is still making them these days (is Donnie Smith still doing them?).
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Old 10-24-2012, 03:15 PM
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Sorry to be so tardy getting back -- on a family vacation. Thanks so much for all the great help on this problem. I'm still scouring for sources and parts, don't want to make the same mistake twice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shepherd View Post
That is THE best looking vstar chop I've seen though! Can you post a pic of the shaft side? would like to see how you handled the drive and any additional details of the build would be awesome!
Thanks for the compliment; it was built by Simon at SFK Cycles in Salt Lake City for his personal bike, on a low budget. Here's a pic (with some close-ups) of the left side of the bike.

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Old 11-08-2012, 11:43 AM
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This is my solution.

I would change to springer forks . Much better than the telescopic forks with that amount of rake.

Springer forks have almost no offset. That will reduce the trail a lot.
Probably down to 5 or 6 inches.

The forks need to be just a little longer too.

Measure from the bottom of the bottom tree to the center of the axle.
That measurement is with the weight off of the front forks.
add about 3 inches.

Also you should not have to reach way out for the bars. Get more pull back.
You need wider bars and that will give you more leverage.

If you have the money just get a Sugar Bear front springer fork.
Call them if you got the dough. That bike is worth it.
That is about $2600.00 but nice if you can afford it.

Last edited by donald branscom; 02-10-2014 at 07:47 PM..
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Old 04-16-2014, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shepherd View Post
It looks like those are zero rake trees...you could try raked trees, or I do believe there are raked cups, but my understanding of their effectiveness is somewhat limited...tightening the bolt will not solve the issue properly. I second the Springer idea...raked trees will fix the flop, but may lower the front end slightly, where as longer rockers on a springer accomplishes the same decrease in trail without changing the level of the bike.

That is THE best looking vstar chop I've seen though! Can you post a pic of the shaft side? would like to see how you handled the drive and any additional details of the build would be awesome!
Raked trees will make the problem worse.

He needs to REDUCE the trail.
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Old 04-17-2014, 08:03 AM
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Agree on the springer....But at least 4 over on the legs with 45 deg. ...Probably with an additional 5 or 6 in the trees.
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